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Unknown A
Say that I had some role in persuading the Ukrainians to fight for their country. Great means fat stealing life. There is method in Donald Trump's madness.
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Unknown B
The chainsaw for bureaucracy. Chainsaw.
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Unknown C
Big, huge cuts. That's how you do it. He's not cutting enough. Frankly, they're dripping with fat.
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Unknown B
Elon Musk has now got 13 kids by four different women.
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Unknown D
I don't love Elon. Creating infinite babies with zero intention on being a father.
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Unknown E
This shouldn't be litigated in public.
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Unknown F
Elon is a dick, boss. Okay?
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Unknown B
Five years ago, you ran into a fridge to avoid being interviewed by me.
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Unknown A
I'm making amends by giving you the longest interview I've ever given you. Anyway, take care.
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Unknown B
Boris Johnson was British prime minister between 2019 and 2022, placing him at the very heart of the global response to two historic disasters, the COVID pandemic and Russia's invasion of Ukraine. President Putin says that Johnson personally talks Alinsky out of a peace deal in the very early months of the war, something that Johnson has emphatically denied. That deal reportedly involved Russia withdrawing to its position before the full scale invasion in exchange for Ukraine giving up NATO's membership and receiving security guarantees from its allies instead. Many influential US Conservatives, led by Tucker Carlson, have accused Boris Johnson of therefore being culpable in the subsequent loss of tens of thousands of lives. Well, to answer for himself, Boris Johnson joins me from Kiev in Ukraine. Boris, good to talk to you.
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Unknown A
Hello, Piers. How are you doing? Yes, I think I caught your introduction just about. And first of all, let me say how absolutely tragic it is to be here in Kyiv with this war still going on and how heroic the Ukrainians are. They are going to win. They will be successful. But you know how ugly and unpleasant it is to hear some of the misrepresentations that have come out of, of Washington in the last 10 days or so, really peddling the Kremlin line such as the one actually that you've just repeated. Not that in a sense suggesting you're endorsing it, but saying that Ukraine was responsible, started this war, saying that Zelensky is a dictator, saying the Ukrainians could have done some deal early on in this war, got the Russians out, that wouldn't have involved a complete humiliation for, for Ukrainians. It's just lies.
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Unknown A
It's just rubbish. And it's very painful for people who care about Ukraine, actually know the facts to listen to this stuff. But, but Piers, you know, and I've seen some of your commentary on this, I remain optimistic Nonetheless, that there is method in Donald Trump's madness and actually that by shaking things up in the way that he is, he can continue to drive the process of peace in Ukraine. And I'll just give you one example, Piers. Look at, look at what's happening with this deal now on resources. Actually it contains some great stuff for Ukraine. It's not yet agreed. It's the one that the Americans proposed to the Ukrainians a few days ago. But the Ukrainians have done very well in negotiating it now has stuff in it, important stuff about American commitment to a free, sovereign and secure Ukraine. American commitment to keep investing in the security of Ukraine from the fund they set up.
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Unknown A
American commitment to financial support for the long term stability and development of Ukraine. That is, that is good, good language. What is. And that is a great commitment. You know, Ukraine needs to be economically bound into the west, bound in to America. And this agreement, this resources agreement would help to do it. I think what's preventing the signing of this deal, sadly, is some of the polemic, some of the rhetoric that we've heard in the last 10 days. But I'm sure that it will get done and it will get done, I think, very, very soon when it happens. What we in the UK need to do is come in with strong support for what Trump is trying to do to deliver peace and show how we are going to fulfill our obligations to Ukraine by setting up with the French, that European deterrent force in Ukraine, boots on the ground, as Keir Starmer has rightly said, not in a fighting capacity, but there to provide logistics and training, support.
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Unknown A
Probably about 30,000 people. And that will show, not from the UK but 30,000 all in. That will show the Americans that we are actually serious in our concern, in our determination to ensure peace and security in Ukraine. And that is actually what will, I think, encourage the Americans to remain committed. So it's a grim situation. It's terrible that the Ukrainians are still fighting. But after three years of war, Vladimir Putin has not and will not conquer this country. I can tell you in the last year, all this nods and other lies that Putin is making inexorable process progress towards victory. It's a great big, fat, steaming, stinking lie appears in the last year. He's, I think, taken 0.5% of Ukrainian territory at a cost of about 420,000 trillion troops. It is not going his way. He is not going to win. What we need is to, for Europeans and to dial down some of their anxiety, some of the rhetoric, everybody, to dial down the rhetoric, look at what Trump is actually proposing and do a deal that will guarantee Ukraine's security for the long term and reflect the reality which is, I think, for
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Unknown A
Putin, this war is basically unwinnable.
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Unknown B
Okay, look, I concur with much of what you said there. I do. I said on accident. I think you've been steadfast in your support for Ukraine from the very start, and that's very laudable. I felt exactly the same way that you have about this. But there is this weird disconnect by many in America, particularly on the conservative right, who do not share our view, who seem to think that Zelensky is the real villain here and that Putin was provoked into doing this to safeguard his own security because of NATO encroachment and so on. What do you say to that? Specifically?
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Unknown A
Mad. It's totally mad. It's through the looking glass. It's the complete opposite. Putin was not provoked into this act of aggression. His. His 115 Battalion Tactical Groups that attacked from the north, from the. From the east, from the south. They didn't have some fault in their sat navs. And the Ukrainians, frankly, were completely innocent and did nothing to provoke him, nor did NATO provoke him, by the way. You know very well, Piers, that the reality of Ukrainian membership of NATO then was, you know, a cat's chance in hell. It was going to be going to be so many black balls who would have looked like sheep droppings, frankly. The French would have vetoed it, the Germans were going to veto it. The Hungarians, the Americans certainly weren't going to pay. It was never going to happen. And now I think there's an overwhelming argument for it.
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Unknown A
But before February 2022, it was absolutely never going to happen, not in a month of Sunday. So that is complete nonsense. And by the way, to say that I had some role in persuading the Ukrainians to fight for their country is a great. It's obviously totally implausible, but it's also a great big, fat, steaming lie. It's true. I went to Ukraine early on in the conflict after they'd kicked them out of the Kiev area. And look, all I said then was were lost in admiration for what you have done for the heroism of the Ukrainian people. We can't. But we can't be more Ukrainian than the Ukrainians. If you have to do a deal in Istanbul or wherever, then obviously that's a matter for you. What I said was, if, on the other hand, you fight on, I just want you to know that we in the UK are going to do our absolute level best to support you in any way that we can.
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Unknown A
That's all I said. And I think any UK Prime Minister, frankly would have said the same in my position.
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Unknown B
Piers Morgan Uncensored is now proudly independent. If you like the show, we ask for only one thing. Subscribe on YouTube and follow Piers Morgan Uncensored on Spotify and Apple podcasts. Now, let's get straight to the point. Support for today's show comes from a business focused on a critical issue. Prosperity. U.S. national debt is at crisis levels, inflation has made life more expensive for everybody, and the stock market is precarious enough to make anyone's financial future feel grim. So what is the solution? Well, a simple one is to opt out of the chaos and invest in something solid and reliable. Physical gold and silver. And there's only one name you need to remember. American Heart for Gold. This company has earned the trust of thousands of customers with an A rating from the Better Business Bureau and glowing reviews. You can see for yourself. They offer an incredible range of gold and silver bars and coins.
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Unknown B
They can be delivered directly to your door or they'll help you set them up in a tax advantaged gold ira. First class customer service makes the whole process simple, secure and straightforward. American Heart for Gold is committed to getting the truth out there and giving you peace of mind in uncertain times. And if that wasn't enough, you'll get up to $15,000 worth of free silver when you make your first purchase. And mention my name, Piers. So make the smart move. Call 866-692-2474 or text PIERS. That's P I E R S 265-532. That's 866-692-2474 or text PIERS 265-532. All the details are in the description. Now on with the show. Why do you think, Boris, I've been really confused that if you went back 30 years, the idea that anybody on the conservative right in America would not be all in favor of supporting a sovereign, democratic European country in defending itself against a Russian dictator would be unthinkable.
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Unknown B
And yet now there is a significant number of people, conservatives, Republicans in America who for some reason think that it's fine that Putin has done this and he was provoked and he should be able to take the land he's taken and that's it. I don't really understand what has changed here in their.
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Unknown A
No, I think it's, it's, it's creepy. It's creepy and it's, it's bizarre. But I think there's always been a strain in America of isolationism. And there's always. And I think it's partly just a lack of enthusiasm for embroiling America in any. In any European theater of conflict. And, you know, we saw that in the Second World War, two years before the Americans came in. And as I pointed out many times before, one of the reasons why people are anxious about this deal, the resources deal, is they think the Americans are being too rapacious. But remember what they screwed out of US peers in 1941, 1940, 19, we were on our knees. Britain was fighting alone against Nazism. And the Americans still demanded as a price for Lend Lease. They demanded there was the basis for destroyers deal. You remember, we had to give up a lot of our bases in the Caribbean.
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Unknown A
We had to give them a base in Newfoundland. They gave us sort of rust bucket destroyers that didn't really work. And then we had to pay billions of dollars to America during the Second World War, when a billion dollars was really a lot of money. In fact, we paid so much money to America that we stopped paying cheques. The UK taxpayer last wrote out a check to the United States for the support we had in the Second World War under Lend Lease in 2006, when Ed Balls was economic Secretary to the treasury and Tony Blair was Prime Minister. So what I'm trying to tell you is America, in my opinion, will continue to be the arsenal of democracy. I have no doubt that America is going to continue to support Ukraine. But today, as always, American politicians, whether on the right or wherever in Congress, they're setting a price on their support.
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Unknown A
And they're. They're just as they did with Franklin D. Roosevelt. They are constraining, as you, as you rightly say, they're constraining. What I think Donald Trump wants to do, and I think, like you, I think his fundamental instincts are in favor of standing up to Putin and in favor of a sovereign Ukraine. That's.
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Unknown B
I hope that is the case. I think that is the case. I think a lot of this is Trump being the dealmaker, which he's very skillful at, and in putting America first. Just spell out for me two messages, one for Donald Trump. What is your message to him? You know him well. You worked alongside him when you were British Prime Minister. And secondly, Keir Starmer, who's now your successor as Prime Minister in this country, is going to the White House on Thursday. What's your message for Starmer when he's standing there next to Trump?
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Unknown A
Yeah, so my message to Donald Trump would be what I. What I said to him repeatedly. Look, his commitment, Pete Hegset's commitment to a sovereign, free, secure Ukraine, that is the key thing. Everything flows from that. That's great. Keep focusing on that. Putin can't live with that. Putin's eventually going to lose this thing. Donald Trump is doing the right thing to focus on a sovereign Ukraine. Starmer needs to go out and show how we, the uk, with the French, are going to provide that deterrent force to help the valiant, valiant, heroic Ukrainians to turn their country into a steel quilled porcupine that is basically indigestible to any future attack by Vladimir Putin. That's what we need to do.
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Unknown B
And when it comes to.
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Unknown A
I gotta love you and leave you.
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Unknown B
One last question, Boris. When it comes to. Thank you.
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Unknown A
I've got to go. I've got to. I'm so sorry.
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Unknown B
One last thing before you go, Boris.
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Unknown A
Which is just gone.
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Unknown B
5. Five years ago, you ran into a fridge to avoid being interviewed by me. It's a long time to spend in a fridge.
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Unknown A
I'm now in a glorified fridge.
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Unknown B
Did you get.
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Unknown A
I'm not. I'm not.
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Unknown B
Did you get hypothermia?
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Unknown A
I'm not making amends by you being. I'm being in a. I'm not. I'm making amends by giving you the longest interview I've ever given you in a place that is substantially colder than most domestic fridges. Anyway, take care.
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Unknown B
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Unknown B
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Unknown B
Elon Musk says that failing to reply will be considered a resignation. Democrats are outraged. The union called it cruel and disrespectful. For his part, Musk has said it should take no longer than five minutes and that it's a basic test of whether millions of federal employees have a pulse and are even reading their emails at all. Well, Doge continues to face legal and political challenges to its aim of stripping billions from the federal budget. Elsewhere, President Trump has fired six top military officers and what has been dubbed a purge of the Pentagon. And MSNBC has canceled George Reid and what I'm dubbing a purge of the. Well, let's just say I thought she was utterly useless. Plenty to debate with my panel Canadian businessman, investor and Shark Tank star Kevin O'Leary, Joanna Carducci, also known as JoJo from JERS, publisher of the User Mag newsletter on Substack, Taylor Lorenz, and the co host of Verdict with Ted Cruz, Ben Ferguson.
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Unknown B
Welcome to all of you. Ben, let me start with you to kick things off. I mean, I got to say, there's so much stuff coming out of the White House, it's almost impossible to keep up with it. There's a kind of electric dynamic energy to it, which is very infectious, which I wish we had over in Britain, I have to say. But at the same time, it's alarming people, it's unsettling people. We've never seen this kind of thing before, and some of it I really agree with, and some of it I don't. We'll come to it later. But I hate the way that both Trump and Elon have been going after Zelinsky in such a personal manner. We'll come to that. But I love what they're doing with Doge. So let's start with Doge. You know, I think the whole principle of someone like Elon Musk, the most successful business guy in the World right now, taking his expert swathe right through federal spending and unearthing so many obviously egregious waste of money.
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Unknown B
I can't imagine most Americans, and by most I mean a significant majority, are not cheering from the rooftops.
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Unknown E
Yeah, they are. And part of this comes down to the accountability in the private sector. And like the email is a great example of this. The fact that there's so many on the left and the Democrats, the union that are triggered saying this is like an abusive email and that it's mean spirit and evil is going to trigger people to then clearly you need to leave your job. Welcome to what Americans deal with in the private sector every day. This wasn't a mean email. If you've read it and I've read the email, talked with Elon at CPAC and look, he's saying it is time for accountability. What the hell did you do in your job in the last five days? Tell me what you're doing so that we know if you even read your emails or you even exist in this fear of no one coming to work in the federal government and office buildings and they come out and they say the left comes out.
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Unknown E
They're like, well, this is somehow just evil means spirit. Act like an adult. Grow up. You don't wear a diaper anymore. You're an adult in the private sector. I have to answer every day. You do too. With ratings for this show, if your ratings go down, there's accountability for that. You and I are judged in the harshest way. I've never gotten the corner and cried. I've never called a lawyer or a union representative to protect me. It's the real world. And when you are a taxpayer, it is time for you to demand accountability for your tax dollars. That's all Elon Musk is doing. And anyone that's afraid this, please don't respond the email. Do not show up for work. We don't need you.
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Unknown B
Yeah, I mean, Taylor, I mean, what's wrong with anything Ben just said?
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Unknown G
Yeah, I mean, listen, I am all for more accountability and a more limited government in many ways. I just don't know that creating more red tape and this email system is the most efficient way to, to restrict the government. I mean, it just doesn't make any sense. Who's going to read these emails? Like you're just creating more work and also what if people are out there on vacation?
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Unknown E
Problem.
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Unknown G
Pardon more.
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Unknown E
This is not red tape. It's a simple question. If you're going to read the email.
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Unknown G
Who'S going to read them and evaluate all of peers emails.
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Unknown F
If he's going to interrupt, can I interrupt him? Because, I mean, I would like to make a point because this, I mean, if we're going to interrupt each other, let's just go there because what you said was hectic and frenetic peers. And by the way, I just want to take a moment and acknowledge that you and I agree on what's going on with Donald Trump and Elon Musk painting Zelenskyy as a dictator. And I, and I cannot believe it's a cold day in hell that we agree. But I just wanted to acknowledge that because I appreciate you saying something that is factual in that regard. This is not hectic or frenetic. This is chaotic. And that email came through on a Saturday night. And as Senator Tina Smith said, Elon is a dick boss. Ok? Half of the people that it was sent to were not even checking email on a Saturday night.
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Unknown F
Some of them are park workers who don't check their email on a regular basis. Some of those people had, you know, information that was sensitive that they shouldn't be sharing over, you know, an open server like that. And Elon sent that email out without the agency heads even knowing it was going out. Didn't consult with them at all. And now most of them have said to those employees, please do not respond to this email.
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Unknown E
That's actually not true.
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Unknown F
Red tape.
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Unknown G
That's not true. Tulsi Gabbard said to not respond to the email. Even Tulsi Gabbard said not to respond.
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Unknown F
That is 100%.
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Unknown E
So I can explain to you the email. Cash Patel and Tulsi Gabbard made it very clear.
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Unknown F
Literally.
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Unknown E
Again, again, I was just at cpac. I actually know these people. I know Cash well. And what they said they were juggling.
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Unknown F
Chainsaw was, hey, yes, okay, good.
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Unknown E
Not respond. Let me finish. Do not respond back to this email. You're going to go to your direct superior and respond to them. So there's a chain of command here because some of these people deal with national security. But the idea that you're treating adults like coddled little children, saying they don't check their email, everybody's got a damn phone. I check my email all the time. If you're such a little wuss that you can't check a phone, do you work?
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Unknown B
You don't.
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Unknown F
Are you dealing with the job?
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Unknown E
You can hire them. If this is who you guys want to hire is people that are like, oh, I can't check my email till Monday, then you Hire them and you'll have a failure of a business. But in the real world, you check your damn email by chains of command.
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Unknown B
Oh, stop shouting.
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Unknown F
In the real world we have chains of command.
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Unknown B
Hang on to Kevin now.
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Unknown E
But we do in the government.
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Unknown B
Okay, here's my point I would make. I've got a, not a massive team of people here, but if one of them complained about getting an email over a weekend, for example, I would know instinctively, and they're all probably listening to me, but I would know instinctively they're not right to work on this show. You know, we're not a fight. We're not a 9 to 5, Monday to Friday show where you clock off and that's it. We're an all consumer.
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Unknown F
They didn't complain, they didn't know what to do.
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Unknown B
Channel which their lawyers. Yeah, but you didn't know what to do. This idea, you'd be traumatized by an.
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Unknown F
Email because there was no chain of command.
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Unknown B
Well, let me bring in Kevin. Let me bring in Kevin.
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Unknown F
If one of your producers were to do that without consulting with you, if they were to send you on a Saturday night without consulting with you, that's good. And if your employees then said to you, I don't know what I'm going.
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Unknown B
To do here, I'd probably promote them.
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Unknown F
That sounds kind of chaotic. I mean, a chain of command seems like a big horrible.
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Unknown B
If one of my employees was working on a Saturday night, as many of them do, by the way we met, we often worked on weekends. If one of them did that for an initiative, great. Kevin, you've employed a lot of people. What do you make of this whole debate around Elon's email?
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Unknown C
First of all, for the average American voter, and we know that they, on a majority basis put Donald Trump in power, they don't give a damn about this. They actually don't care about anything other than making sure that a lot of these claims are verified. And so if Elon runs around and says, look, there's 500 million wasted here and 200 million wasted here, it's very disconcerting. Trump has a 24 month mandate now before midterms. He's doing all this very quickly because he knows come the midterms he may not hold a majority anymore. But frankly, nine out of ten Americans think this is a very good idea. And there's something to be considered here from the real world. As we've been talking about the real world. When you are in a turnaround situation and I invest in these and have for 30 years, you go into a bankrupt organization and you cut as much as you have on the spreadsheet at the beginning, plus 20%.
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Unknown C
And why do you do that? Because you don't know what you don't know. And you want to do the cut all at once, Big, huge cuts, so that you don't have a situation where every two weeks you're letting more people go. You want the impact to occur all at once. Then you hire back to fill in the holes of one of the mistakes you made. That's how you do it. And that's what I wish Elon was doing. Because he's not, he's not cutting enough, frankly. These organizations have been growing for a long time, decades, without ever being trimmed. They're dripping with fat. And I think there's a lot more work to be done here. But this email chain thing, nobody cares. It doesn't matter. And if these employees actually aren't reading their emails, whether it's Saturday night or Monday morning, they should be fired because maybe they haven't been reading them for months or years.
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Unknown C
Nobody knows. And do they really go into an office? Nobody knows.
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Unknown B
Well, there's even a theory that some of them might not be alive but are still receiving paychecks. And Kevin, you said this, you said keep slashing, keep hacking while you have this 24 month mandate. You just alluded to cut, cut, cut, cut, cut more and more cutting. Believe me, it's going to work out great. What's interesting about, we said about Elon Musk when he bought x for the $40 billion, the very first thing he did on day one was I think he fired half the workforce, 7,000 or so people, and guess what? Carried on coming out and was fine. And now it looks like, according to.
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Unknown G
The report, he's worth half of what it was when he bought a.
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Unknown B
Come to that, Taylor, Taylor, on that very. I was about to finish my sentence to say that the reports in the last few days are that the valuation of X is now believed to be as big as what he paid for it, if not more. Because so many blue chip companies are coming back to advertise.
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Unknown C
X is the example.
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Unknown F
Like I said, substance.
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Unknown B
Hang on, hang on. I'll come to you guys. Let Kevin respond and I'll come to you, I promise.
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Unknown C
Listen, the measure of what X is worth is what the debt. That's the proprietary stock on the balance sheet. It's trading at parity again. It was down as low as 40 cents after he slashed 7,200 employees. Now it's back. That's an example of how it works. And it's back in less than three years. And so at the end of the day, the same thing should happen in the government and the big agencies he hasn't even started with yet. The military, the Pentagon. Now, what they get to say in past decades is always, well, you can't touch our budgets. We're defending the country. We are opaque. We're not transparent. They're pushing all that aside. They want to see where the billions go, how they're used, and how it's measured in terms of success. I think there's a lot of money wasted there, and we're going to find that out, too.
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Unknown C
But remember, it's all going to happen in two years. So you talk about breakneck speed. There's a reason, and everybody should just chill out. Don't worry about it, because this is the only way to do it. Cut deep, cut hard, and then hire back to fill the holes. That's what he's doing.
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Unknown E
And by the way, they were compassionate when they sent out a meeting.
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Unknown F
Yeah, I'm talking about FBI that need.
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Unknown E
Years of training, that peers. They were passionate. They were compassionate on the front end of this by sending an email out offering a massive severance if you wanted to leave the government and not come back to work in an office. Something that the private sector would never offer to millions of employees. So for all of these people that.
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Unknown F
Are crying, employees are going to get.
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Unknown E
That money at all, the payout. You should have walked away when you had a stupid good deal in front of you if you knew you were a lazy person and you didn't want to check an email.
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Unknown G
All right, well, most of our money goes to the military employees getting those.
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Unknown B
Hang on. Don't talk over each other. Let's go to Taylor first, then Jojo.
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Unknown G
I was just going to say most of our money goes to the military and defense contract, and I totally agree, actually. Well, okay, but I'm saying, like, it goes to debt.
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Unknown E
We have more debt servicing than we do military spending.
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Unknown F
Let her talk. Could we stop being so rude?
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Unknown G
I don't think anyone.
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Unknown E
It's bad information to say that our.
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Unknown B
That the military timeout, it goes to what Kevin was. If you all talk at the same time, nobody can hear you.
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Unknown F
Why do you need to be heard?
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Unknown B
If you all talk at the same time, no one can hear you. Taylor, finish what you wanted to say.
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Unknown F
Taylor's turn.
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Unknown B
Jojo, I'll come to you and then I'll let Ben respond. Taylor first, I don't think.
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Unknown G
Look, I Don't think anyone here would dispute that we spend quite a bit of money on the military. Okay. No matter what you think of that now, I would love to see Elon Musk come in with his chainsaw and do similar cuts on that bloat. I think we all have parts of the federal government that we would like to see cut quite indiscriminately. I just think this is an inefficient way to go about it. I don't know who's reading these emails. It seems inefficient. I think park rangers are not going to be checking their email. Like, sure, you run a 24 7.
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Unknown F
No.
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Unknown G
In a more strategic way.
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Unknown B
What does that mean?
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Unknown E
I generally want to know.
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Unknown G
I think.
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Unknown E
I really do think.
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Unknown F
I.
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Unknown G
Okay. I think performance reviews are great. I think allowing people who are managing some of these people that actually have knowledge of what they're doing, saying, hey, look, you have to cut X amount and doing it more strategically, I think this is kind of messy and honestly inefficient. But look, I would love to see some more.
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Unknown F
Should also go through the chain of command.
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Unknown B
Okay.
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Unknown E
JoJo describing. It's what we've been doing. It's a disaster.
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Unknown B
I want to let JoJo go.
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Unknown F
We do have systems in place. I'm sorry, Taylor, that you did not get to finish most of your answers. I guess the guy who's on the podcast with Ted Cruz doesn't get enough time to talk. But I just wanted to say back to the idea of 9 out of 10Americans being in support of these doge cuts. I don't know where Kevin got those numbers, but maybe somebody on Shark Tank manufactured them in front of you. They're not real. Because actually, polling has revealed that Donald Trump is underwater. And if you've seen the news lately, you've also noticed that in red districts all over the country at town hall meetings, Americans in very ruby red districts are voicing their displeasure and dissatisfaction with the state of things as they are right now. And they're wondering why Elon Musk has been given this sort of tyrannical reign that they didn't vote for.
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Unknown F
This is not wildly popular. I'm still waiting for anybody on this panel to tell me when the winning starts, because I'm thus far looking around going, we don't. We don't seem to have any winning. You're just looking at.
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Unknown B
Well, that's okay. I mean, I would say I don't have a weakening. Hang on, Joe. I don't have a horse in the race. But only this morning, Apple have apparently guaranteed Trump and it's all been announced that they're going to put half a trillion dollars, I think it was into the. Is that right? I can't remember the exact figure. Was it? Kevin, you probably know how much is Apple putting in?
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Unknown C
Just under half a trillion.
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Unknown B
Right. But it's a staggering into investment in America, which wouldn't have happened probably if Trump hadn't had the meeting with Tim Cook from Apple. So you say there's no winning going on. There is a lot of.
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Unknown C
There is a lot.
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Unknown B
Hang on, Jojo, hang on. There is a lot of money pouring into America which was being outsourced, which is coming as a result of all these Mar a Lago meetings that Trump was having with all the tech guys. And they're all, they're all doing what he wanted. They're bringing jobs back to America, but in the middle, opening factories in America. That is. That's a big win, isn't it?
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Unknown F
Are they?
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Unknown B
Yes. Literally just announced.
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Unknown F
But in the meantime, you should explain it doesn't stop in the meantime. Respond to what Pierre said. No, you just like to hear your voice. Can you just say no, I don't like it. Wait a second.
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Unknown E
And they say that Jobs aren't so rude.
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Unknown G
I'm not rude.
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Unknown E
As lying to the American people.
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Unknown B
All right, don't talk over each other. Jojo, Jojo, just answer my question. Jojo, Jojo, you asked what, we asked what winning. Jojo, you said what. You said what you're waiting for the winning. I would say that Apple committing half a trillion dollars to American investment is a big win. Right. And that happened today.
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Unknown F
I was going to respond, I was going to respond to you. In the meantime, piers eggs are 53% more expensive than they were a year ago. Consumer confidence is down, inflation is higher than it was in the last Joe Biden's term prices.
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Unknown B
Who do you blame?
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Unknown F
Are you going to blame Biden for that? Yes, I'm going to blame Donald Trump. I mean, you're going to blame the.
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Unknown B
President who's been blame the guy who's been in charge for one month.
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Unknown F
President who's at the helm.
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Unknown B
Hang on. You're going to blame the guy who's been in charge for one. Hang on. The guy who's been in charge for one month is responsible for the last year. Is that your position?
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Unknown F
This is what is remarkable to me is that every time Donald Trump gets into office, you're steadfast inability to hold him accountable for anything when he is at the helm is remarkable.
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Unknown E
30 days.
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Unknown F
He wasn't responsible for Covid.
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Unknown B
Let me ask. All right, let me ask.
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Unknown F
At what point does the buck stop with the President of the United States?
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Unknown B
You know what?
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Unknown E
I'm a realist.
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Unknown F
Joe Biden, you understood economy, right?
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Unknown E
You would understand it's not his fault.
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Unknown F
In 30 days, Joe Biden didn't inherit Donald Trump's.
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Unknown B
Why don't we go to the.
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Unknown F
Somehow, Donald Trump inherited Joe Biden.
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Unknown B
All right, let me go to the financial expert on the panel, which is Kevin. Kevin, just explain to Jojo the reality perhaps of an economy and how long it takes to do stuff which actually kicks in.
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Unknown C
Yeah. The facts about eggs and protein, inflation, gas and rental housing inflation have nothing to do with Trump. He's only been there for six weeks. The reason we still have inflation over 3%, which is 33% higher than the Fed's target of 2%, and why they won't be cutting rates again this year is because we did four massive multitrillion dollar packages during Biden's administration, including the Inflation act, the CHIPS act, the Infrastructure act, and much of that money is still sloshing around the economy. This was printing money and pouring it out of a helicopter onto the economy we probably spent.
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Unknown F
Kevin, inflation was lowering. It was lowering at the end of Biden's term. It was not increasing. It is going up now. You're telling me that those things that were in place before inflation was.
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Unknown B
Jojo, you seem very, very.
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Unknown F
I don't need an economic expert.
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Unknown B
Jojo, for somebody who hates interrupting, you interrupt a lot. Why don't you let Kevin finish?
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Unknown C
Listen, you can't.
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Unknown F
I do apologize. I just want to correct you.
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Unknown B
Let Kevin finish your rules.
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Unknown F
But you didn't stop the other guy.
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Unknown B
Okay, I'm stopping you.
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Unknown C
Kevin, you can't reduce inflation. In six weeks, maybe two years from now, eggs will be where they were at the beginning of whenever. You want to count the pricing. It's a long haul. The economy is flush with cash free money, including billions to student loan forgiveness. All of that stuff is inflationary. And look, I'm not blaming or saying good or bad. That's what Biden did. He is responsible for the inflation. It's his. He owns it. Now, six weeks in, we're seeing a lot of programs. And the best way to reduce inflation, frankly, and help the country would be to take all of these savings, not send them out to checks. If these dozen savings are true, don't send out $5,000 checks. We don't need that. We need to pay down debt. That's the number one issue right now. And that's the pressure Congress is going to put on Trump.
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Unknown C
Use these savings to pay down debt.
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Unknown B
Okay, Jojo, your response?
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Unknown F
Pierce, did I ask this question? Yeah. I just don't understand why Kevin is dealing in the reality of the fact that inflation was going down at the end of Joe Biden's term. It was lower and consistently lowering than it is now. It has gone up to, I think, June of 2024 levels. So how is it that you're going to attribute this inflation to Joe Biden while Donald Trump is in office? And discount tariffs, some of them were government, etc. All of those inflationary programs. I don't understand. I don't understand how you're associating this increase in inflation to Joe Biden when it was going down at the end of his.
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Unknown E
Let me say this, number one, if you look at the numbers that they change the employment numbers in November, December, they have changes to them. That's number one. Whose fault is that? That would be Joe Biden's economy. Then if you go and look at it, I don't know why that's confusing or you have that weird face right now. They change numbers all the time and they say, hey, we thought we added X number of jobs. We actually didn't. They also change inflationary numbers as well. I don't understand how that's so hard for you understand. But again, this goes back to what Doge is doing. And if you look at Doge, we have more spending per month on servicing the debt of the money we borrowed in this country than DoD spending. And so I'm not sure what you're fighting against. If we have a bankrupt company, and that is the United States of America right now, there's no one that would invest in.
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Unknown E
If it was a private company, it would have gone under. We are trillions of dollars in debt. There should be slashes and cuts everywhere. The president inherited a terrible economy with insane inflation because of all the free money.
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Unknown B
Let me ask you, Ben, let me ask you. Hang on, Ben, let me ask you a question then. When should we be judging Trump on the status of the American economy? When should we judge him on the inflation rate, for example? In other words, at what point does the Biden effect come sweeping through? And actually, it's all on Trump.
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Unknown E
When you talk to economists, most of them say it's 12 to 16 months before you get a real window of what is taking place now and how it's affecting the economy. But there's many out there that they just want to win. So they go to the egg prices, for example, which was a problem with flu and everything else that we know about. The killing of many of the chickens and the hens, that's part of the problem. We saw prices go up. Now what has the President done? He said we got to lower the price of grain, we got to lower the price of gas, we got to lower the price of production, and we got to do what we can to help the prices come down. But you got to understand, there are some people, it's not really about helping Americans. It's about scoring political points.
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Unknown E
And you've seen that today. They want there to be bad news and American suffering so they can point and say it's Donald Trump's fault in six weeks, which is insane. And I think they know it, but it's pushing political agenda.
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Unknown B
All I would say. Okay, all I would say. Hang on. All I would say is that they're actually doing exactly what you guys would do if it was the other way around. Just for the record.
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Unknown E
No, I wouldn't.
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Unknown B
Yeah, you would.
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Unknown G
It's not true.
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Unknown B
You would. Ben Ferguson. Ben Ferguson. I've known you. I've known. God, how long have I known you? I've known you 15 years. I know you.
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Unknown E
We're both getting old, my friend.
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Unknown B
We're getting old. Let me bring in Taylor. Taylor, I want to show you a clip. This is from the seat back. This is where Elon Musk goes mad with a chainsaw. This is the chainsaw for bureaucracy. Chainsaw.
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Unknown E
Game likes game, right?
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Unknown C
Game knows game, right?
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Unknown E
I tell you, it's game. The gentleman sitting in the White House, Donald J. Trump. It's a glorious day. Days of thunder. Days of thunder and years of lightning. Every day is Christmas Day. Every day you get more executive orders, more executive actions. It's not going to stop and we're not going to retreat, we're not going to surrender, we're not going to quit.
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Unknown A
Fight, fight, fight.
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Unknown B
So there were two things there, Taylor, which might have concerned people. One is Elon Musk going berserk with a chainsaw, which was given to him by President Milei of Argentina. And obviously we all got the point. He's taking a chainsaw to Federal overspend. But it was a weird scenario on stage there. Some will love flying around with that chainsaw looking slightly bonkers. And I would argue that Elon may not even realize this, but he may be sucking up a little too much attention for Donald Trump's liking. But we'll come to that particular ego issue later. The second point was the arm signal which Steve Bannon made at the end, which he would argue is a deliberate attempt to wind up the libs many people think was a fascist salute and wasn't even an accident. And that following on from what Elon did, which I do not believe was a Nazi salute for a moment, that actually there's a fine line between winding up the libs and actually embracing or encouraging genuine fascists.
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Unknown B
So what are your thoughts on these two things? First of all, chainsaw Elon.
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Unknown G
I think it's bizarre. I mean, I think Elon just wants. He's dressed in, like, the Doge Father outfit. I feel like he just. I mean, he just wants to perform for the cameras and drive headlines. I don't even think he knows how to turn on the chainsaw. I think he's kind of inept and just seeking attention. And I think ultimately that might be his downfall.
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Unknown E
And in that billionaire got it.
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Unknown G
Yeah.
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Unknown E
I mean, he is richest man in the world.
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Unknown F
We inherited billions.
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Unknown G
And that's in terms of communicate. He's just out, like, what is he even saying? I'd actually prefer to hear him talk about Doge in any sort of coherent way rather than waving a chainsaw. I think he's seeking headlines. I don't think. Whatever. Anyway, I don't really care about that. Or have a, you know, he goes off and performs and wants headlines. That's what he's doing. And by the way, that's what Bannon is doing, too, with his, like, you know, salute gesture or whatever you want to call it. It's just. It's just an attempt to garner attention and like you said, troll lives. I think it's quite concerning because actual neo Nazis interpret those hand gestures in a certain way. And you're seeing those people celebrating this hand gesture becoming normalized. I think that whatever it is, a Nazi, like, it is reminiscent of a Nazi salute.
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Unknown G
If you don't consider it a Nazi salute, we can all. We all know what a Nazi salute looks like. I think normalizing that hand gesture right now in this climate is incredibly irresponsible and stupid.
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Unknown B
Yeah. I mean, Ben, you know, I think that when Musk did it, he probably. It was done innocently, is my honest view about that. He meant it from the heart to them. I got that. But when people start doing it afterwards, very deliberately, you know that that's not an accident. They're making a deliberate point now. They might be being funny, as they would put it, but you can if there's often. If there are too many people on the maga, Right. Who start doing this, it will encourage people who are attracted to political groups who may be genuine fascists to say, hey, these guys are my guys. That's not a good thing, is it?
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Unknown E
Look, I had dinner Friday night sitting next to Bannon. And if you're a guy like Bannon who was attacked by the government and found in contempt and dragged off to prison the way he was, and then you see a media which goes after Elon Musk because he waves at a crowd and says it's a Nazi salute, which everyone, including you peers, knew was not, would I want to troll them? Because I have a different perspective because of what happened to me. Yeah. Is he mad? Sure he is. Is he ready to fight back? Yes. Was he willing to go to jail over it? Absolutely. Should he be doing it by the government? Yes. I wouldn't do it. I can say that.
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Unknown B
So that's the point.
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Unknown E
Bannon has a different perspective.
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Unknown B
No, no.
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Unknown E
It is absurd that they attacked Elon Musk because they're so afraid of the guy saving money, they say, oh, he did a Nazi salute. So is he trolling them? I'm sure he is. And I don't blame him for being that angry. Honestly, no.
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Unknown B
But it's interesting. It's interesting. Interesting that you admitted you wouldn't do it yourself, though. And I'm good. It's glad to hear. Jojo. I mean, I think there is an issue. If they keep. If people keep doing this from stages representing Trump and the MAGA movement, I think it is gonna backfire. I think you're gonna start seeing some ugly stuff go on with genuine fascists coming out saying, these are our people.
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Unknown F
I agree. And Taylor's exactly right. You know, those. The neo Nazis and the fascists, they're perceiving it as a message to them, so it is worth noting that. But also think about trolling, like trolling somebody by making a reference to Nazis who. You know, these are the people who responded.
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Unknown E
The first reference to Nazis with Elon Musk, and you know he didn't do it.
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Unknown F
I'm sorry, once again, I was in the middle of a sentence.
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Unknown B
Thank you. I think your argument about interrupting JoJo. JoJo, with respect, your argument about. Hang on. Your argument about interrupting JoJo was slightly diminished by the way you interrupted Kevin, just for the record.
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Unknown F
Oh, Piers. Are we gonna move up past that now and continue to let this happen? We are if you don't stop interrupting me. You've now corrected Me in the midst of being interrupted instead of correcting the man.
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Unknown B
I'm kind of bored of people who I kind of bored of people who make a big deal of being interrupted, then interrupting people, then playing the victim. But I wasn't then playing the victim about being interrupted from the interrupting.
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Unknown F
You corrected me instead of him.
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Unknown B
All right, Kevin, let's bring Kevin in.
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Unknown F
Let's call a space station.
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Unknown B
Let's bring Kevin in.
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Unknown F
I want to finish. Say something then and referenc Nazis because as you know, peers, what we're looking at with Putin on the march right now in what is happening and potentially happening in Europe to then that the correlation between that and trolling people by using that symbol, make no mistake, we know what's happening right now and it cannot be normalized. You yourself would know that and agree. You said you wouldn't do it. And I forget the gentleman's name on the right. He said he wouldn't do it, but he never said why. He never said why he wouldn't do it. And we all know why he wouldn't do it. Why nobody on this self explanatory. I just wanted to say that it's.
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Unknown E
Self explanatory because I don't want to.
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Unknown F
Be connected with Nazis.
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Unknown E
But no, like saying I wouldn't do it and the fact that you need some sort of explanation. And I'm happy. But let me, let me apologize.
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Unknown F
Matt. He should be able to ask the question.
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Unknown E
I'll answer it. I already explained why I think Steve Bannon did what he did. And for everyone else watching, I apologize. You guys are going to tune out for 30 seconds while I explain this very simply to one human being. And I apologize because you guys.
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Unknown B
Hang on. Ben, Ben, it's a legitimate question. Just explain very quickly why you wouldn't do it.
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Unknown E
Because I don't ever want to be connected to anything that would look like aiding, abetting people that are Nazis, that want to take out Jews who I stand with and the people of Israel who are under attack right now, that's just not my style.
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Unknown B
See, I agree with you. I agree with you.
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Unknown E
To go in that area.
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Unknown B
I agree with you.
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Unknown E
That's not my style.
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Unknown B
Right, I agree. But that is, that is something that I think that memo is not getting received. Let me bring in Kevin on this. I mean, Kevin, from, from a leadership point of view, if you were Donald Trump, how comfortable are you about the constant attention seeking stuff by Elon Musk? Does it matter? Would you care is he stealing oxygen that maybe you would want to limit to the President. I mean, how do you feel about that?
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Unknown C
First of all, they've already addressed that. Elon Musk does not have any executional mandate. He can only make recommendations as a special government employee. That's the designation he has. There's others in the White House that have that designation. Gets around the lobby laws that exist. They don't have to abide by them because they're doing direct work for the government through the executive. That's technically what's going on. But he's addressed it in multiple interviews as recent as last week. There's a lot of criticism about this and I understand it. And when you look at social media combined with traditional linear and cable media, you've always got to assume two and a half percent lunatic fringe. And we have that here for sure. Now, the issue is more or less, you've got someone with an incredible track record. Elon Musk has an incredible track record. He's probably the most successful entrepreneur in modern times and he has 24 months to do what he's doing.
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Unknown C
You either think it's a good idea or you don't. You're not going to change your mind. I submit that the majority of the population is intrigued by to get the information about how much waste there potentially is, how it gets implemented and how you execute on it. Is that the purview that only can be done by Congress. So while everybody's going crazy talking about this, the actual processing of these cuts, including the big prize, which would be the Pentagon, has to be implemented with surgical precision through Congress. And that's what will happen. Having said that, the big stick that Elon has, and he said this too, and this too is extraordinary. If you're in Congress and you vote against these cuts when the majority wants them done, I will invest in making sure you lose your next election contest. That's a serious threat and it's completely legal.
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Unknown C
He can invest in any riding he wants, any jurisdiction, any county, in any state against an incumbent who is not supporting the Doge mandate. An incredible situation. Frankly, I see no problem with it.
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Unknown B
Okay, hang on. Taylor. I want to bring Taylor. I'm actually going to switch gears. Well, I'm going to bring Taylor actually on something else, which is to do with the Elon Musk baby mama drama, because you actually have been responsible for the latest development on this because a friend of the show, Ashley Sinclair, who came on only a week ago actually, but didn't reveal the little secret she was keeping, has had Elon Musk baby or says she has and you revealed a series of new revelations about this for those who haven't been following as assiduously as me, but just summarize exactly what you were doing with Ashley.
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Unknown G
Yeah, so I didn't do anything with Ashley. I broke the news, which was available in public court documents, that Ashley Sinclair, who had Musk's latest child, has filed a paternity suit and custody suit for the youngest child, her new son. So she's seeking sole custody of the child and also seeking to establish legal paternity. This comes right after, you know, more drama with Elon Musk's previous baby mother, Grimes, who tweeted just last week that the son, another child of them, was in the midst of a medical emergency. There's been, they had a huge custody bottle, etc. Etc. So I think Ashley's hoping to avoid some of that. And yeah, seeks sole custody.
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Unknown B
Okay, well, the Ashley Sinclair story has led to some traditional conservatives questioning the morals of a new Republican establishment. Jeremy Hamley from the Quartering Channel is one such voice and he joins the panel now. Jeremy, great to have you on Uncensored. First time we've had you. Thank you for joining us. You think there's, I mean, I gotta say when I saw what you were saying here, that nearly every single conservative influencer is congratulating a twice single mom on another out of wedlock child with a man who has zero intention on marrying her. Elon's a degenerate and shares criticism for his actions too. When I saw that, I was surprised actually that more people were not pointing out there's a sort of weird double standard going on here which is a kind of embracement, embracing and celebration of all this when actually a conservative Christian right perhaps perspective would normally be pretty censorious.
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Unknown D
Yeah, I think it was pretty disappointing to see a lot of these people call themselves Christians or Catholics or religious and preach a lot of different morals about family, the core family, traditional values. And it was pretty appalling to see everyone race into the replies. And I do want to be clear. I think both parties here are, you know, I think in many of these cases the women take a lot of extra heat. And I think, as she St. Clair, that there's plenty to criticize. But I also think I don't love Elon creating infinite babies with zero intention on being a father. And I don't think that these women who are agreeing to do IVF knowing that he's not going to be in their life is a traditional conservative value. And it's something that the Conservatives aren't calling out because they don't want to wreck their connection to Elon Musk, at least in my opinion.
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Unknown D
Even if it's tangentially.
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Unknown B
You actually criticized Taylor directly. So Ashley Sinclair literally ran to Elon deranged leftist Taylor Lorenz to smear Elon. That's your base based trad Conservative Queen Con Inc. Ha ha ha ha ha. So you weren't impressed by. You weren't impressed by Ashley running to Taylor?
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Unknown D
Well, I love. I've got a lot of love for Taylor. Happy birthday, Taylor. But, you know, I think she's patient zero for Elon derangement syndrome. So I thought it was pretty funny that she was, you know, breaking the news. Now, if Ashley didn't go to her directly, as she is now clarified, it's a little less interesting. But I do think it was funny for somebody who was begging for privacy, was happy to be taking pictures of private signal conversations on a secondary phone for further lawsuits, run to a spread with the New York Post and all this stuff set up weeks before the Valentine's Day meltdown. This woman was never a conservative. She has tweets going back to 2020, for example. Here's one of my all time favorites, if you'll allow me to share it. It says if a woman. If women get the right to abortion, men should have the option to not pay child support.
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Unknown D
I think that's pretty rich for somebody who's currently suing for full custody. And I think we all know why she's suing for full custody.
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Unknown B
Okay. I mean, Taylor, you've also criticized Elon for using his son in the Oval Office. You said Elon Musk, the dad, Fluenca, the billionaires leveraging his son to rebrand himself as a father figure just to bring. Bring Taylor back in a moment. I mean, Taylor, first of all, what. What do you say to Jeremy about the criticism about Ashley Sinclair running to you, given how you're such an unlikely bedfellow for this particular debate?
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Unknown G
Again, these are public court documents on a website that every reporter in the country has been checking relentlessly. And I, being on California Time, was up and got the scoop. I don't really know what to tell people that I don't know what Elon derangement syndrome is. I am a. I am a very nonpartisan critic of both sides of the aisle. I think Elon has done some good things. I think he's lost the plot on a lot of other things in this instance. Look, I'm not one that subscribes to these Conservative values of, you know, you can't have IVF or whatever, whatever. So I think that. Look, has Ashley made some contradictory statements in the past? Sure. But at the end of the day, this is a mother. Elon Musk, you know, is the father of the child. I think Elon Musk, if you are a conservative, right, you should support fathers being, you know, supporting their children.
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Unknown G
So I hope that he supports his children. I hope he takes care of his children. I think it's concerning how he's, you know, trying to leverage his children to boost his public profile. I've written a lot about the danger.
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Unknown E
Of parent influencers involved with the kids. You don't want him to be involved with the kids. That might be the dumbest statement I've ever heard. He brings his kid around the White House, which is what everybody does. If they go to the White House, they want to show their kids amazing things. If I can bring my son to the open office.
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Unknown G
You don't have to do that on camera. You don't have to do that on camera.
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Unknown F
He will choose this. And you don't do it on camera.
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Unknown G
You can do.
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Unknown B
You can go to the O'Boss.
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Unknown E
This is so much crap. Pierce, let me just say this.
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Unknown B
Well, Ben, let me ask you, Ben, let me ask you, Ben. Elon Musk has now got 13 kids by four different women, right. And the latest mother is a single mom who's been married and divorced and so on. I mean, how does that sit? Does that sit comfortably? Any of that. Those series of facts with your conservative Christian right beliefs?
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Unknown E
Would it be a life that I would lead? No. But all I care about is the kids. And do they have a mom and a dad who are able to grow them and mature them and spend quality time with them without clickbait and people throwing stones and trying to tear down the mother or the father like this shouldn't be litigated in public, number one. Number two, you. The idea that Elon Musk needs to spend time with his kids but not in public is just unrealistic. When you are as famous as he is, any other celebrity out there and you have kids that are around you, they're going to be in the public eye. You can try to protect them. But being able to go to the White House, being able to go to the Oval Office, spending quality time with your son there, getting to do that.
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Unknown E
I have three sons. I absolutely would take them the Oval Office if I had the opportunity.
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Unknown B
I think that's. I mean, being a good dad. Yeah, yeah. Let me Bring in. Hang on, hang on.
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Unknown F
Can we talk about conservative values?
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Unknown G
Okay, Jojo from the media.
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Unknown B
Let me ask Jojo for reaction.
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Unknown F
Well, I want to talk about the degradation of conservative values between Donald Trump and Elon Musk. They have 17 children between six women. Donald Trump, I was talking. Donald Trump is a thrice married serial philanderer who is also, by the way, an adjudicated rapist. You don't care about business fraud and a convicted felon. I was talking. So I want to talk about the degradation of conservative values. Piers, to your original question, which is this is the slippery slope where we see where they were once, you know, beholden to Christian values more than they are now. Now they have someone who worships at Our lady of the Perpetual Mulligan every Sunday and doesn't so much as open go to church other than to go shake a Bible upside down after tear gassing peaceful protesters. This is not the party of family values like they hold themselves up to be or profess themselves to be.
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Unknown F
This is not the back the Blue Party. They do not stand with our troops because if they did, they wouldn't be gutting the VA and they wouldn't be pardoning those who attacked our police officers on January 6th. This is just yet another slide down slope from the.
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Unknown B
All right, let me.
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Unknown F
Okay, I want to know.
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Unknown B
All right, let me. Okay.
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Unknown F
Why Republicans abandon their moral support.
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Unknown B
Okay, let me bring in Kevin. Let me ask Kevin. Kevin, does any of this matter or has the Donald Trump double success winning the presidency twice despite everybody knowing all about his private life, which has been generous, has been lively, but does any of it now matter? I mean, if I think about Democrat presidents, there was probably no greater philanderer in the history of world leaders than John F. Kennedy. For example, Bill Clinton has sex with an internal in the Oval Office while he was Democrat president of the United States. So I don't think the Democrats are in any position to lecture anybody about family values or fidelity. However, does it matter now? I mean, I get the sense people think about Musk. Well, he wants to increase the population and he's leading by his own example. I don't think people really care anymore. Now does it matter is my question.
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Unknown C
No, it doesn't. This isn't really what people worry about, you know, when they're trying to figure out how to make ends meet at their kitchen table. For millions of Americans making 68,000 on average, they couldn't care less. The one thing I would say though, that is occurring now because of the. I would say the mastery of social media that Trump has pulled off in this latest election is a lot of soul searching with the Democrats. You know, one of the things I have to do, I don't have a choice is I'm an investor. So I really have to be bipartisan because I also invest in states that are blue and I know the governor's there. And, you know, I speak at their conventions as much as I do at Republican ones because I have no choice. Entrepreneurship's bipartisan. So I've met a lot of the fundraisers in the last few weeks with the Democratic Party and they are doing a complete reset in terms of their messaging to their base.
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Unknown C
What they can't understand is how Trump and he used social media to do this more than linear television. He was very masterful at doing interviews with people like you, Pierce, and then taking 15, 38, 49 second, 59 second snippets of it and reposting it on every single social media program enhanced. And what he did, and the one that they're most concerned about during that last four months of the election was steal the working man from the Democratic Party. How is it possible that Donald Trump became the champion of the working man? And unions across the east coast and west coast, how did he do that? How did he reach them? What about Michigan? The Michigan example is being studied by the Democrats right now. How did he do that every swing state?
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Unknown B
Well, I have a theory because unions are corrupt. I'm going to bring in two final stories and put them together.
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Unknown F
Actually, the tax cut is getting.
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Unknown B
Hang on one second. I'm going to play two clips because I think that, yes, it was about the economy, yes, it was about immigration. But I do think this war that Trump and Elon Musk waged using social media, like you say, on wokeism in all its guises, the woke mind virus, I think that played a massive part in this. I think Trump was, to many people, common sense against insanity with this woke stuff. And interestingly, two things happened yesterday. One was that MSNBC's Joy Reid, who loves to say that she's woke, the woke queen of cable news, actually in my estimation, one of the most vicious, unpleasant, race baiting racists I've ever seen on cable news, frankly, she got fired because actually, you know what people woke up and realized she's not woke in the way that the nice people like it to be. She's woke in that awful, vicious, shaming, canceling sense.
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Unknown B
And the second time we had, second thing last night was Jane Fonda then saying this at an award Show.
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Unknown F
Make no mistake, empathy is not weak or woke.
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Unknown C
And by the way, woke just means.
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Unknown F
You give a damn about other people.
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Unknown B
The. Yeah, I mean, Ben Ferguson on that. The two things are not disconnected. You have one Joy Reid, finally getting her come up as thoroughly deserved. But also you have the complete delusion, and I believe deliberate delusion of Jane Fonda. I've interviewed her. She's a tough lady, brilliant actress, a lot of admiration for her. But the idea that wokeism is this is this wonderfully warm, empathetic movement that shows you care is for the birds.
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Unknown E
Yeah, look, I think the American people have realized that this is basically irrelevant to their lives. We tried it, we tried this, everything. Go woke, cancel culture, fight back and try to destroy everyone's life. Just like you've heard in these smut stories. Trying to attack Elon Musk and the women that have a relationship with him. The American people care about. Is it safe to go outside and play? Is it safe to send your kids to school? Are my kids in a failing school? Can I give my kids a better life than I had? And if you want to know why Donald Trump did so well in the closing argument with the American people is because while they were pushing dudes in sports with women and demanding that parents can't show up and have a voice at their conferences at their schools and referring to them as domestic terrorists, the Republican Party listened and said, we understand what you're going through.
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Unknown E
We want to give change to that. We want to help you succeed and we want you to have a better country for your kids than what you have right now. And so as long as they go up there and they try to talk down to America and say, well, what means you give a damn? No, woe means you're out there probably trying to ruin someone's life and get them fired for their job and try to ruin them or put them in jail.
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Unknown B
Yeah. Taylor. Taylor, I've got a ruining someone's life, Taylor. I'm not of the conservative right at all. I'm pretty centrist. I'm just a journalist. I fell out with the liberal world completely over this woke stuff, cuz it's just completely nuts. I'm like Bill Maher in all this. Right. I just think it's beyond my comprehension that you could have people on the left who genuinely think it's fine that biological men wreck women's sport. It's madness anyway, luckily.
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Unknown G
But okay. But the idea that the Democratic Party, Kamala Harris, who, like, doesn't, with all due respect, all she said about trans people is like, I'll leave it up to the states. As if Kamala Harris was some champion, though.
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Unknown B
That's not true. That's not true. Kamala Harris and Joe Biden endorsed the right of trans athletes to compete in women's sports.
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Unknown G
But again, they believed brought them to the White House.
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Unknown F
You know what?
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Unknown E
We brought them to the White House.
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Unknown G
This is not something. This is just simply not something that the majority of Americans voted on. The idea that the.
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Unknown B
I don't agree.
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Unknown D
I think it is.
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Unknown B
I think you're completely delusional.
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Unknown F
Statistically. She's right.
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Unknown G
Support this.
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Unknown B
All right, let me bring it. Let me bring in Jeremy. Hang on. Don't all talk. Jeremy, you're nodding away there. I think it played a big part. And I would cite the New York Times report about the they Carmela. So they Trump is for you, they say moved the needle maybe three points. I think it was massively significant. Underbelly of debate was about this Woke crap and that Trump they saw along with Musk as basically the common sense antidote to all this stuff.
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Unknown D
Look, nobody did more to get Donald Trump elected than Hollywood elites in the Democrat Party. There is a reason that once the Trump started running the ads, Kamala's for, you know, Trump's for you commas for they them. There's a reason he ran that ad. I live in a swing state. That was basically the only ad he ran for the last three weeks running up to the election. And that tells me that based on their data, it was resonating with people, regular people. Res. You know, this all. You know, California liberalism. I get it. It's funny to make fun of, but people, when they go and vote, they don't want anything to do with it.
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Unknown B
Let me tell you. Woke is dead, which. Hang on, hang on.
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Unknown G
That we can agree on. That we can agree on.
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Unknown B
Woke is dead, which is coincidentally the title of my forthcoming book, which will be released by HarperCollins worldwide in the fall. In the fall. So I'll expect enthusiastic support from all of you. I've got to leave it there. It's been a great debate. You've all been terrific. Thank you all very much. Here's Morgan, Unsensored, is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. You enjoy our show. We ask for only one simple thing. Hit subscribe on YouTube and follow Piers Morgan uncensored on Spotify and Apple podcasts. And in return, we will continue our mission to inform, irritate, and entertain. And we'll do it all for free. Independent, uncensored media has never been more critical, and we couldn't do it without.