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Unknown A
Let's dig into the other big breakthrough you've just made in your gaming world models. I'd love if you can tell me a little about that.
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Unknown B
Yeah, so I think we're going to call it Muse as what I learned is they're going to be the model of this world human action model. And this is very cool. Dall? E and Sora have been unbelievable and what they've been able to do in terms of generative models. And so one thing that we wanted to go after was using gameplay data. Can you actually generate games that are both consistent and then have the ability to generate the diversity of what that game represents and then are persistent to user mods? Right. So this is the other publication in Nature. And the cool thing is what I'm excited about is bringing, you know, so we're going to have a catalog of games soon that we're going to train these models to generate and then start playing them. And in fact, you know, when Phil Spencer first showed it to me, where, you know, he had an Xbox controller and this model basically took the input and generated the output based on the input and it was consistent with the game.
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Unknown B
And that to me is a massive, massive moment of wow. It's kind of like for the first time we saw ChatGPT complete sentences or Dolly Draw or Sora. This is kind of one such moment.
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Unknown A
This in itself is incredible. You, through your span as CEO have invested tens hundreds of billions of dollars in building up Microsoft Gaming and acquiring ip. And in retrospect, if you can just merge all of this data into one big model, that can give you this experience of visiting and going through multiple worlds at the same time. And if this is the direction gaming is headed, seems like a pretty good investment we have made. Did you have any premonition about this or a good coincidence?
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Unknown B
I would say that we invested in gaming to build models. We invested, quite frankly. Here's an interesting thing about our history. We built our first game before we built Windows, right. Flight Simulator was a Microsoft product long before we even built Windows. So gaming has got a long history at the company and we want to be in gaming for gaming's sake. And that's. I always start by. I hate to be in businesses where there are means to some other end. They have to be ends onto themselves. And then, yes, we are not a conglomerate. We are a company where we have to bring all these assets together and be better owners off by adding value. Right. So for example, cloud gaming is a natural thing for us to invest in because that'll just expand the TAM and expand the ability for people to play games everywhere.
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Unknown B
Same thing with AI and gaming. We definitely think that it can be helpful in maybe changing. It's kind of like the CGI moment, even for gaming long term. And it's great. As the biggest world's largest publisher, this would be helpful, but at the same time, we've got to produce great quality games. I mean, you can't be a gaming publisher without sort of first and foremost being focused on that. But the fact that this data asset is going to be interesting, not just in gaming gaming context, but it's going to be a general action model and a world model. It's fantastic. What YouTube is perhaps to Google gaming data is to Microsoft. And so therefore I'm excited about that.
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Unknown A
How does this fit into the other, separate from AI, the other things that Microsoft has worked on in the past, like mixed reality, maybe giving smaller game studios a chance to build these AAA action games in an interesting way.
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Unknown B
Even I got a five, six, seven years ago is when I said, like, the three big bets that we want to place is AI, quantum and mixed reality. And I still believe in them. Right? Because in some sense, like, what are the big problems to be solved? Presence. That's the dream of mixed reality, which is, can you create real presence like you and I doing a podcast like this? I think we are still, like, it's proving out to be the heart of one of those challenges. Quite honestly, I thought it was going to be more solvable. It's tougher perhaps just because of the social side of it, right. Which is wearing things and so on. Very excited about, in fact, what we're going to do with Adderall and Palmer now, with even how they'll take forward the IVAS program, because that's a fantastic use case.
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Unknown B
And so we'll continue on that front. But also the 2D surfaces, it turns out, things like teams, right. Thanks to the pandemic, we've really gotten the ability to create essentially presence through even 2D. And that I think will continue. That's one secular piece, the quantum we talked about. And the AI is the other one. So these are the three things that I look at and say, how do you bring these things together ultimately, not as tech for tech's sake, but solving some of the fundamental things that we as humans want in our life and more. We want them in our economy, driving our productivity. And so if we can somehow get that right, then I think we would have really made progress.